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Topic: Abu Hasan has not memorized Forty Hadith, or 5 juz from the Quran!
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 rasheed.b
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Member
Posts: 187
Joined: Sep 2002
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http://mypage.ayna.com/abo255/hgor2.rm(قال الشيخ : أن أبا الحسن لا يحفظ الأربعين النووية ولا يحفظ خمسة أجزاء من القرآن ... فهو يريد أن يُحيي قواعد صلاح الصاوي من جديد ... والشيخ مقبل يعرف الكثير عن أبي الحسن فلقد كان سيخرج في أبي الحسن شريطاً عندما كان في السعودية لأنه يعرف أنه فرّق الشباب بسبب جمعيته ...!)
The Sheik (Yahya Al Hojoore)said, Verily Abu Hasan has not memorized Nawawi's Forty hadith, nor has he memorized five juz of the Quran...So he(Abu Hasan) wants to revive the principles of Salaahu As-Saawi...And Sheik Muqbil knew alot about Abu Hasan, therefore he was about to put out a tape about Abu Hasan when he was in Saudi, because he knew that he(Abu Hasan) was dividing the youth because of his group.
End of Sheik's words
translated by rasheed barbee
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| abu.naimah.shamsuddi
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Salamu alaikum wa rahmatullah;
Are you referring Abu Hasan Al-Misri from Yemen?
Abu Na'imah Shamsudden
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| rasheed.b
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Member
Posts: 187
Joined: Sep 2002
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As-salaamu alaikum,
Yes this is about Abul Hasan Al Misr,Al Ma'rabi from Yemen.
Jazakumu ALLAHU kharian.
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| abu.naimah.shamsuddi
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Member
Posts: 132
Joined: Dec 2002
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wa alaikum salam wa rahmatullah;
Are there any of Abul Hasan's students here in the U.S.? Like some of the Imams that adhere to his same teachings that those of us who seek correct Aqeedah wal manhaj should avoid?
Abu Na'imah Shamsuddin
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| Abul.HasanMalik
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It is very easy to see examples of those who are upon his methodology. Look at the following examples of comparison in the speech of Abu Usaamah Adh-Dhahabee and his teacher Abul-Hasan Al-Ma'ribee. Also we have added some of the points of refutation against them from the likes of our Sheikh, the carrier of the flag of Jarh wa Ta'deel in our time, Abu Muhammad Rabeeus-Sunnah ibn Haadee al-Madkhalee, and also our Sheikh, the destroyer of innovation, Faalih ibn Naafi' Al-Harbee, may Allah preserve them both.
Abu Usaamah said in his paltalk lectures titled: Benefits from the Abu Bakr As-Siddeeq seminar on side two of tape one:
??the people of the Sunnah they know when to apply the truth, today unfortunately the brothers of the da?wah, this new tayaar, this new current, this new wave, it?s a tidal wave. Today the people of the da?wah today what they do is what happened in our masjid right here people hated the da?wah because of the way brothers dealt with them, not all of the brothers some of the brothers, certain brothers, everyone is a deviant, everyone is astray, threatening, everyone and his mother is astray, so we have to be careful even now in other places this is the way that the du?aat of the da?wah are, everything is rough and tough, and very seldom do we find people dealing with the creation in a way that?s going to cause the da?wah to grow, cause people to embrace the da?wah??
He also stated:
Then he said on the same tape: ??now many people think that it (jarh wa ta?deel) is fashionable, they think that it is fashionable, so you?ll find a man he doesn?t know the ahkaam (rulings) the nun saakin in tajweed, which is an obligation for him to know, Allah ordered us in the Qur?an:
وَرَتِّلِ الْقُرْآنَ تَرْتِيلًا
Read the book properly. That?s an order in the Qur?an to know about the nun saakin, everyone has to know how to read the Qur?an properly?but all you?ll find from people is jarh wa ta?deel, criticizing and praising, criticizing those who don?t deserve to be criticized, or he criticizes them in a way that they don?t deserve to be criticized, and he praises those who don?t deserve to be praised.? (End of quote from tape)
He states on page 7 of his bayaan that he distributed by E-mail and which was also posted on the site of the masjid in Luton, England:
Whoever sides with the Sheikh and the 'MUHQIB' is a true Salify, and a defender of As-Salifiyyah, and a subduer of deviance. The cream of the crop and a protector not of the planet, but the universe, etc. etc. It doesn't matter that he is ignorant of the proper way of reading Quran with Tajweed (which he has been commanded to know). It matters not he's ignorant of the basics of his Deen and blameworthy for being so.
He states on page 8:
?And his reward in today's climate of 'Al-Jarh Wa Tajreeh' is that he's painted as being the troubled soul! The one of desires! The one who is on the minhaj of the Khawaarij and the Takfeeries! He doesn't respect the scholars! He thinks too much of himself! He's putting doubt in the minds of the youth, and turning them against the scholars!?
He goes on on page 8:
?The claim of the 'MUHQIBEEN'1 and the 'MUQALLIDEEN' is going to be, 'those people who still support Abu Usamah (and those who are better than Abu Usamah from the MAJOR STUDENTS of knowledge) are all wrong, as the clear (?) proof has arrived! Sh. Rabee (ha) and Sh. Faalih (ha) have issued warnings against Abu Usamah (and others), and that's proof in and of itself.' (Allahu Akbar!!!)2
They will say, 'the scholars of Al-Jarh Wa Ta'deel use to pass verdicts on people, and their verdicts would be accepted no matter what (?), and without any verification (?), because this is the acceptance of the news of a reliable person!
And they'll go on and on and on trying to dazzle the minds of the people by quoting true Islamic principles from the science of Al-Jarh Wa Ta'deel. But the proper application and the conditions of those principles are never explained.? (End of qote)
He stated in another E-mail that he sent out to the brother Jalil Meekins via internet dated Thu, 11 Jul 2002:
?Wallahi, if Shiekh Rabee' (ra) wanted to destroy QSS, all he has to do is warn against us in one statement and then it's all over the Internet and the streets of Bubbaville that we're all off of it!
The Shiekh doesn't have to be aware of the evil of a statement like that because he's the Imam of jarh and ta'deel and the brothers will push whatever he says without question.?
He also said in an E-mail dated Thu, 14 Nov 2002 titled Subject: Fwd: Jarh wa Tadeel by Allamah Ash-Shaikh Abdul-Mohsin Al-Abbad:
?It appears that our Salifi brothers who go over board in Al-Jarh Wat-Ta'deel and labeling people see themselves in a war and they are bent on winning at all cost!?
Now we want to quote similar statements that can be found from Abu Usaamah's teacher to prove that they are upon the same methodology.
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi says in the tape titled Usuul wa mumayyazaatud-Da?watis-Salafiyyah:
?The one who reads the biographies of the Salaf and takes from the way of the salaf in the their understanding of the Speech of Allah and the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه و سلّم an expansive methodology that will encompass the whole of the Ummah and will encompass the people of the Sunnah, as for those who only understand from Salafiyyah refutation, dispute, and insult, and those who do not understand anything except that so-and-so has entered salafiyyah and so-and-so has left, and those who don?t understand from salafiyyah anything except disputing with their brothers, honoring a group of them today, differing with them tommorow, praising people today, dispraising them from the minbars tommorow. These ones have erred in the way of understanding the call of the Salaf.
You see groups rise and you see the leaders of the groups dragging his group here and there, and all of them think that they are Sheikhul-Islaam and that they are the ones who open up the doors of good and close the doors of evil, and he may be tested by his desires, and he may be proud of a group of Non-Arabs who were Christians and Jews just yesterday and today they have become Imaams in the science of Jar wa Ta?deel, there has come from amongst them Abu Zur?ah Ar-Raazee and Ibn Ma?een, there has come from them Yahya ibn Sa?eed Al-Qattaan and Shu?bah ibn Hajjaaj, and here they are not knowing anything else from Islaam except this issue and this miskeen becomes happy that these ones sit around him saying, ?Sheikh so-and-so, Sheikh so-and-so?
He says also on the cassette titled Al-Fahmus-Saheeh (no.1):?And there is not a writing without the principles of the people of the Sunnah and there is not a writing with the condition that is found with some who ascribe to knowledge, and they are ignorant, don?t know and hasn?t smelled the scent of knowledge, many of the people entered the Da?wah As-Salafiyyah and don?t understand anything from it except that so-and-so entered the sunnah and so-and-so has left from it.?
He said on the same cassette: ?So you see one of them loving another one from them as long as he he talking about people even if he doen?t have anything from piety, or he doesn?t have anything from fear, and he doesn?t guard his prayers, what is important is that he talks about so-and-so and warns against so-and-so, then Ma Sha Allah he is the lion of the Sunnah, a hardcore Salafi, a rock, and he is such-and-such, and they come with labels that are not put in their proper place we ask Allah for safety.?
He says on the same cassette: ??and this is the condition of many of these reckless ones who ascribe to ranks of Salafiyyah in the issue of Jarh wa Ta?deel, so they attack with their ignorance in issues that they don?t know what is in front it, or what is behind it, what is to the right of it, and what is to the left..?
He says on the cassette Raf?ul-Hijaab (no.4): ?And beware of thinking that our call is only to refute the groups, and as for our hearts then there develops in them from hypocrisy and from Riyaah (the disease of wanting to be seen), and they are diseases of the heart, beware of thinking that our call is like that, our call first and foremost is the actualization of Al-Ubuudiyyah for Allah within ourselves, this aspect, the aspect of the refutation of the people of innoavation is only one door from the blessed doors, so a man closes the [other] doors of good and closes the openings of good from his heart so there only enters into his heart from thisopening, there doesn?t enter into his heart anything from the religion of Allah except from this opening only this one is deprived O brothers.?
If one looks at the comparison in the style of speech that has proceeded, and even the very wording in many places, as we will expound upon shortly In Sha Allah, one could easily see that Abu Usaamah Adh-Dhahabi and Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi are one on the issue of how they see the Salafis who ?busy? themselves with refutation and Jar wa Ta?deel. The tone is also the same as they both use negative epithets to drive home their point that they are dealing with a most aunory bunch. The speech is the same in not only style, wording, and tone, but it is also a mirror image in methodology.
Let us make a comparison between the two by categorizing them and placing them back to back.
First: Their description of the Salafis who refute as being extreme:
Abu Usaamah says from the aforementioned quotes:
1. ??but all you?ll find from people is jarh wa ta?deel, criticizing and praising.?
2. ?Today the people of the da?wah today what they do is what happened in our masjid right here people hated the da?wah because of the way brothers dealt with them, not all of the brothers some of the brothers, certain brothers, everyone is a deviant, everyone is astray, threatening, everyone and his mother is astray, so we have to be careful even now in other places this is the way that the du?aat of the da?wah are, everything is rough and tough, and very seldom do we find people dealing with the creation in a way that?s going to cause the da?wah to grow, cause people to embrace the da?wah??
3. ?It appears that our Salifi brothers who go over board in Al-Jarh Wat-Ta'deel and labeling people see themselves in a war and they are bent on winning at all cost!?
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi says in the aforementioned quotes:
1. ??and this is the condition of many of these reckless ones who ascribe to ranks of Salafiyyah in the issue of Jarh wa Ta?deel, so they attack with their ignorance??
2. ?The one who reads the biographies of the Salaf and takes from the way of the salaf in the their understanding of the Speech of Allah and the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه و سلّم an expansive methodology that will encompass the whole of the Ummah and will encompass the people of the Sunnah, as for those who only understand from Salafiyyah refutation, dispute, and insult, and those who do not understand anything except that so-and-so has entered salafiyyah and so-and-so has left, and those who don?t understand from salafiyyah anything except disputing with their brothers, honoring a group of them today, differing with them tommorow, praising people today, dispraising them from the minbars tommorow.?
3. ?So you see one of them loving another one from them as long as he he talking about people??
Second: Their claim that the ones they speak of do not know or understand anything from Islaam except Jar wa Ta?deel.
Abu Usaamah says:
1. ??now many people think that it (jarh wa ta?deel) is fashionable, they think that it is fashionable, so you?ll find a man he doesn?t know the ahkaam (rulings) the nun saakin in tajweed??
2. ?Read the book properly. That?s an order in the Qur?an to know about the nun saakin, everyone has to know how to read the Qur?an properly?but all you?ll find from people is jarh wa ta?deel, criticizing and praising??
3. Whoever sides with the Sheikh and the 'MUHQIB' is a true Salify, and a defender of As-Salifiyyah, and a subduer of deviance. The cream of the crop and a protector not of the planet, but the universe, etc. etc. It doesn't matter that he is ignorant of the proper way of reading Quran with Tajweed (which he has been commanded to know). It matters not he's ignorant of the basics of his Deen and blameworthy for being so.
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?rabi says:
1. ??and those who do not understand anything except that so-and-so has entered salafiyyah and so-and-so has left, and those who don?t understand from salafiyyah anything except disputing with their brothers??
2. ??with the condition that is found with some who ascribe to knowledge, and they are ignorant, don?t know and hasn?t smelled the scent of knowledge, many of the people entered the Da?wah As-Salafiyyah and don?t understand anything from it except that so-and-so entered the sunnah and so-and-so has left from it.?
3. ?So you see one of them loving another one from them as long as he he talking about people even if he doen?t have anything from piety, or he doesn?t have anything from fear, and he doesn?t guard his prayers, what is important is that he talks about so-and-so and warns against so-and-so.?
Third: Their exaggeration in speech about those they speak about:
Abu Usaamah says:
1. ?Whoever sides with the Sheikh and the 'MUHQIB' is a true Salify, and a defender of As-Salifiyyah, and a subduer of deviance. The cream of the crop and a protector not of the planet, but the universe, etc. etc.?
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi says:
1. ??a group of Non-Arabs who were Christians and Jews just yesterday and today they have become Imaams in the science of Jar wa Ta?deel, there has come from amongst them Abu Zur?ah Ar-Raazee and Ibn Ma?een, there has come from them Yahya ibn Sa?eed Al-Qattaan and Shu?bah ibn Hajjaaj??
2. ??what is important is that he talks about so-and-so and warns against so-and-so, then Ma Sha Allah he is the lion of the Sunnah, a hardcore Salafi, a rock, and he is such-and-such??
3. ?? and all of them think that they are Sheikhul-Islaam and that they are the ones who open up the doors of good and close the doors of evil.
Fourth: Their claim that those who have been praised or criticized by them was not done properly.
Abu Usaamah says:
1. ??but all you?ll find from people is jarh wa ta?deel, criticizing and praising, criticizing those who don?t deserve to be criticized, or he criticizes them in a way that they don?t deserve to be criticized, and he praises those who don?t deserve to be praised.?
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi says:
1. ??then Ma Sha Allah he is the lion of the Sunnah, a hardcore Salafi, a rock, and he is such-and-such, and they come with labels that are not put in their proper place . We ask Allah for safety.?
Fifth: Their call to an alternative to what they see from refutation.
Abu Usaamah says:
1. ?? everything is rough and tough, and very seldom do we find people dealing with the creation in a way that?s going to cause the da?wah to grow, cause people to embrace the da?wah??1
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?rabi says:
1. ?The one who reads the biographies of the Salaf and takes from the way of the salaf in the their understanding of the Speech of Allah and the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه و سلّم an expansive methodology that will encompass the whole of the Ummah and will encompass the people of the Sunnah??
Sixth: ?Their exageration in speech.
Abu Usaamah says:
?When you read the post and you hear the statements of these people in their Masaajid, you will find them ALMOST ALWAYS resorting to their dictionaries of verbal abuses. The Rabid Dog! He?s a Dajjal! The Jaahil One! He?s the greatest trial of the Dawah since the fitnah of the creation of the Quran! He?s the greatest fitnah in modern times! If the Dajjal comes back, so and so will follow him because he?s a follower of desires!?
Al-Ma'ribee says:
"Their use of severe, harsh, crude expressions for their opponents from Ahl us-Sunnah, such as their saying, "So and so is more vile, or a greater liar, than the Jews and Christians", or "the vilest of those upon the face of the earth", or "more astray than the people of innovation", or "he has brought what has not circulated in the mind of Shaytaan since the history of mankind", and also their saying, "Dajjaal, Kadhdhaab, Faajir, Affaak, Atheem, Muraawigh, Mukhaadi', Maakir, enemy of the Sunnah, one who wages war against the Salafees, the Kibaar amongst them and the Sighaar, khabeeth, maai', mumayyi', daall, mudill, mubtadi' khabeeth, kadhdhaab ashirr, one of the Dajjaajilah, the Rawaafid are better than him, the [affair of the] Jews and the Christians is lighter than his, if the Dajjaal came out, then so and so would believe in him, or if a man claimed Ruboobiyyah and Uloohiyyah, so and so would have rallied behind him, and zaaigh, hizbee daall, hizbee mutasattir, daseesah, and planted amongst the ranks in order to destroy it, and one who has been empowered by way of the enemies to destroy Salafiyyah, and saaqit, and taafih, and a person of the world..."
Seventh: Their accusations that the Salafis get fatwas by twisting their words and ?tricking? the scholars.
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi said on the cassette titled Al-Haddaadiyyah:
?They gather them together, then mistakes of which no one is free from falling into, and they have certain people that they go back to and get fatwas from them either by deception in the question or openly with one he knows, then they turn around and say, ?These are the verdicts of the scholars about so-and-so?.?
Abu Usaamah says in his bayaan:
1. ?Based upon the loaded and distorted questions presented, unfortunately the Sheikh gives his position. Then comes what the 'MUHQIB' deems as 'THE INDISPUTABLE REFUTATION' that dare not be questioned or even researched!?
He also said in his latest bayaan?
1. ?This was an attempt on their part to practice one of their many BAATIL PRINCIPLES (i.e., getting ready made Fatwas that suit their desires, by doctoring the facts, and taking statements out of context, and then presenting them to the Scholars).?
Eighth: Describing the salafis who refuted them as Ghulaat (extremists, radicals, ect.):
Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi said in the cassette titled Al-Haddaadiyyah:
1. ?We have seen this party of Ghulaat?(extremists, radicals, ect.)?
Abu Usaamah said in his latest bayaan:
1. ??Ghulaat? (extremists, radicals, ect.) who Allaah is testing the Dawat-us-Salafiyyah and the Salafis with, due to their ?ghuloo?, ?taqleed? and ?BAATIL PRINCIPLES.?
It should be noted here that Abu Usaamah used the word Ghulaat (extremists, radicals, ect.) no less than 20 times in his latest E-mail to describe the salafis who refuted him.
After looking at the comparison between the speech of teacher and student we want to bring the refutation of the scholars upon some of these statements. We also should mention that the refutation of the scholars upon the speech of Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi is more than sufficient to refute the words of Abu Usaamah as their statements are one. Also to add to the benefit we will add the specific statements of some of the scholars pertaining to what they heard from the statements of Abu Usaamah and their response to it. We ask Allah for success.
First: His description of the Salafis who refute as being extreme.
Abu Usaamah says: Abu Usaamah says from the aforementioned quotes:
??but all you?ll find from people is jarh wa ta?deel, criticizing and praising.?
?Today the people of the da?wah today what they do is what happened in our masjid right here people hated the da?wah because of the way brothers dealt with them, not all of the brothers some of the brothers, certain brothers, everyone is a deviant, everyone is astray, threatening, everyone and his mother is astray, so we have to be careful even now in other places this is the way that the du?aat of the da?wah are, everything is rough and tough, and very seldom do we find people dealing with the creation in a way that?s going to cause the da?wah to grow, cause people to embrace the da?wah??
?It appears that our Salifi brothers who go over board in Al-Jarh Wat-Ta'deel and labeling people see themselves in a war and they are bent on winning at all cost!?
As has preceded we mentioned that his speech is a spitting image of his teacher Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi. Al-Ma?ribi says:
?The one who reads the biographies of the Salaf and takes from the way of the salaf in the their understanding of the Speech of Allah and the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه و سلّم an expansive methodology that will encompass the whole of the Ummah and will encompass the people of the Sunnah, as for those who only understand from Salafiyyah refutation, dispute, and insult, and those who do not understand anything except that so-and-so has entered salafiyyah and so-and-so has left, and those who don?t understand from salafiyyah anything except disputing with their brothers, honoring a group of them today, differing with them tommorow, praising people today, dispraising them from the minbars tommorow. These ones have erred in the way of understanding the call of the Salaf.
You see groups rise and you see the leaders of the groups dragging his group here and there, and all of them think that they are Sheikhul-Islaam??
Sheikh Rabee in his refutation of Abul-Hasan Al-Ma?ribi titled Tanbeeh Abeel-Hasan Ilal-Qawl billatee hiya Ahsan (pg.42-43) brings this statement under the chapter: Abul-Hasan?s attack against the Salafis and his ridicule of them and his renouncement of Jarh wa Ta?deel. He says in response to these statements in the footnote:
?You have over-exaggerated in your defamation of these youth who have belived in their Lord and who Allah has guided to the Salafi methodology, so you do not have the right to demean them and to go overboard in derogation and defamation of them, also their affair is one of the following:
1. Either they have criticised you with that which is correct and therefore you should thank them and it is obligatory upon you to return to the truth.
2. Or either they have defamed you with falsehood so then you are between two affairs: either you can take the high road and be patient and forgive and pardon (Ash-Shuraa: 43) and Allah will give you the reward of the patient, or you can take the path of justice and show their defamation of you and respond to them with what is equal only and not go beyond that, for indeed exeeding bounds is oppression, Allah says: (Ash-Shuraa:40)
And excuse me Abul-Hasan but we still don?t know what their error is from your speech and that is because your way harms you severly and doesn?t benefit you, and it harms the da?watus-Salafiyyah, and indeed I am advising you, and may Allah forgive us and you, and guide us to the truth and make us those who aid it and defend it, certainly our Lord is the Hearer of supplication.?
Then on page 43 he quotes the statement of Al-Ma?ribi: ?And there is not a writing without the principles of the people of the Sunnah and there is not a writing with the condition that is found with some who ascribe to knowledge, and they are ignorant, don?t know and hasn?t smelled the scent of knowledge, many of the people entered the Da?wah As-Salafiyyah and don?t understand anything from it except that so-and-so entered the sunnah and so-and-so has left from it.? [End of quote]
He then responds in the footnote:
?Excuse me Abul-Hasan indeed in your speech against the salafis are generalizations, vagueness, and exaggeration in defamation, you have taken the path of Abdur-Rahman Abdul-Khaaliq, Ash-Shayajee, and their likes.
And indeed it is from justice that you mention the speech of your advesary and clarify what it has in it from opression and falsehood with clear proofs upon the way of the people of the Sunnah and Jamaa?ah, for there is not before the listener or reader any quotes from those accused, and no references for what you say, so there is no blame on the reader if he believes that these [false] accusations have been placed on innocent Muslims that Allah has forbidden their blood, and their honor. And that they are far removed from what you have described them with, and that your speech is far removed from the principles of the people of the Sunnah and Jamaa?ah, and it may be that that their understanding that so-and-so is a Hizbee (partisan) and that so-and-so has entered salafiyyah and another has left from it is a part of their knowledge, and from their understanding of Aqeedah, and Ahkaam, and knowledge and insight of the path of the rightly guided and the path of the criminals, and knowledge of the principle of the people of the Sunnah and Jamaa?ah in Al-Walaa wal-Baraa, and knowledge of the methodology of the people of the Sunnah and Jamaa?ah in dealing with the people of desires, warning against them and refuting their falsehood, and that this is from Jihaad with the Imaams of the Sunnah, and you know that during the the age of the Imaams like Isma?eel ibn Aliyyah and Ahmad ibn Hanbal and other than them there were those that rejected the speech against the people of innovation and rejected Jarh wa Ta?deel and considered that from backbiting, but that did not disuade the Imaams from continuing in the path of protecting the religion by criticizing those who deserved criticism and praising those who deserved praise and they considered the refutation of the people of innovation jihaad, rather with them it was better than striking with swords, yes for Jar wa Ta?deel has its people and its conditions, but clear innovation like Ar-Rafd, Jahmiyyah, Al-Irjaa, At-Takfeer, and clear hizbiyyah of which the scholars have spoken about and have spoken about their people, then there is nothing to prevent the small student of knowledge to warn against their evil, and it is not from the fundemetals of the Salaf, nor their actions to wage war against the students of knowlegde who warn against these types.? [End of quote]
These words of Abu Usaamah were read upon Sheikh Faalih Al-Harbee: ?Today the people of the da?wah today what they do is what happened in our masjid right here people hated the da?wah because of the way brothers dealt with them, not all of the brothers some of the brothers, certain brothers, everyone is a deviant, everyone is astray, threatening, everyone and his mother is astray, so we have to be careful even now in other places this is the way that the du?aat of the da?wah are, everything is rough and tough??
The Sheikh cut in: ?All this kalaam is general, unrestricted, it doesn?t have a place to stay (i.e. it is homeless). This is not the way of Ahul sunnah, its only the way of Ahul Bid'ah, the way of the opposers of the manhaj of Ahul Sunnah. This is like this, that is like that and this is harsh, what is harsh!? If you can clarify for us, how is the refutation of the people of innovation, warning from the people of falsehood, advising the people, that which we are ordered to do, and its from the deen. Do you consider this harsh? What does he say about the hudood for example? What does he say about cutting off the hands and feet at opposite sides, what does he say about the stoning until death, or lashing, what does he say about admonishment? It doesn?t benefit the creation except that which the Creator Has made as a reconciliation for them. This general kalaam doesn?t suffice anything, rather its astray, corrupt kalaam. What is this harshness? The criterion, the scales aren?t with you! Its not the criterion of man, or the mujtahhideen. Its only for the Shari'ah. That which you relate to harshness, it may be the haqq and it?s the ruling from Allaah and His Messenger and it agrees with that which Ahul Sunnah is upon and the people of truth. As for you generalizing and making these claims, then when will the people accept the truth? Do we say oh people, the ones that have drowned they are to be followed, they have the authority, they are from the people of truth!? No! they are the people of falsehood, the danger is upon the one who opposes (few unclear words) the reason of them becoming astray and deviation is their tarbiyyah, the way they were taught if that tarbiyyah has come from you (Abu Usaamah).?
Second: Usage of the word Ghulaat.
Abu Usaamah said in his latest response: ???Ghulaat? (extremists, radicals, ect.) who Allaah is testing the Dawat-us-Salafiyyah and the Salafis with, due to their ?ghuloo?, ?taqleed? and ?BAATIL PRINCIPLES.?
Abul-Hasan?s statement: ?We have seen this party of Ghulaat?(extremists, radicals, ect.)?
Sheikh Rabee said in refutation of Al-Ma?ribi titled Iaantu Abil-Hasan ala Ruju bilatee hiya Ahsan [pg. 7-8] with regards to this usage of the term Ghulaat when decribing these salafis:
?If these ones are extremists, and they have not come close to the level of harshness against the people of innovation as many of the salaf, at the head of them Umar ibn Al-Khattaab, his son, and the remainder of the companions, and Abdur-Rahman ibnul-Qaasim, Maalik, Ath-Thawree, Hammaad ibn salamah, Ash-Shaafi?ee, Abu Ishaaq Al-Fizaaree, Uthmaan ibn Sa?eed Ad-Daarimee, and other than them, and the salaf used to praise them and made their harshness towrds the people of falsehood from their noble attributes. Indeed those you accuse with extremism and exceding the bounds have not come close to them, so we do not know what your view is of these noble salaf, if you say respect and honor we say, then why accuse their followers of extremism and other than it from evil attributes and exaggeration in blame.?
أهل الحديث هم أهل النبي وإن
لم يصحبوا نفسه أنفاسه صحبوا
This message was edited by Abul.HasanMalik on 3-16-03 @ 6:23 PM
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| abu.naimah.shamsuddi
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Member
Posts: 132
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wa alaikum salam wa rahmatullah;
Jazakallahu khair.
Abu Na'imah Shamsuddin
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24-12-2002 @ 12:00 AM
15-03-2003 @ 12:00 AM
16-03-2003 @ 12:00 AM